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PRINCETON, NJ - The American public overwhelmingly agrees that being physically attractive is a strong asset in modern society, yet only a minority of Americans say they wish that they themselves were more beautiful or handsome. And, despite the aging of the baby boom, and the apparent increase in a societal emphasis on beauty and appearance in recent years, the numbers of those who would like to be better looking or who would consider plastic surgery have not changed significantly since 1990. Additionally, a spirit of optimism prevails when Americans are asked to assess their own appearance. Only 2% of the public is willing to say that they are personally below average in looks; the majority consider themselves to be "average." - [Taken from the Gallup Poll News Service.]
Cory: Okay, this is a true story. I was at a bar a few years ago and I saw two good-looking chicks dancing. So I figure ‘what the heck, why not?’ So I go up and dance with them. They both had this attitude like, "What? You think you’re good enough to come over here and dance with us?" So I just looked at them both and gave the "loser" signal to let them know they were nothing special, and just walked off. It was funny because neither one of them EVER expected that. The shocked look on their faces was a Kodak moment. LOL. I was kind of in a bad mood anyway that night and I didn't feel like taking any ones crap.
So I go up to the bar and order water. Then I see this Pamela Anderson look-alike come up and stand next to me. She then looks over and sees that I'm just drinking water and she asked why wasn't I drinking that night? Next thing I knew we were having a conversation. She was actually very nice. She was also a model/fitness model who ran her own gym. She's been in magazines as well and also Motocross races where she’s won pageant contests. I find that talking to the real hot women are friendlier. Maybe it’s because they have nothing to prove? They don't have to walk around like "Hey, look at me! I'm HOT!" Cuz they just are.
Joel: I think you guys are on to something here. I've had the same thing happen to me recently. These girls that are like "7's" on their best night act like I'm dog meat. The next second I'm talking with the hottest girl in the place - you know - the playboy bunny, and we're drinking, dancing and flirting for the next hour. Weird.
I think the 7's are more approachable. So they probably do get more attention than the 10's. I still see the 10's getting plenty of attention though.
I also think the 7's may be a little more conscious of getting a "hot" guy - because it's part of their status. No one is as cute as the 10's so they've got nothing to prove... and they've already had every hot guy, so now they are actually trying to find someone that's not a jerk. I think age has a lot to do with it too... at different ages I think they act a little differently (in general).
Kristy: Do you guys really do that? Rate girls by their looks on a scale of 1-10? I'm sorry, your post made me laugh. I'm not making fun of you, Joel. I just thought that guys didn't really do that. I thought it was just a movie thing.
Ahhhhh.... the things you learn in the Dating Advice forum....
Now I'm curious. What makes a girl a 10? Or a 7 that you talked about so much? Is a 10 a girl with the Playboy body? A great butt? Do you go on just a body alone? Or do you guys look at the whole thing? (i.e. smile, personality, humor...) I know that was about 117 questions, but the male mind is always a mystery to me. :-) Please, enlighten me.
What if a girl doesn't have a playboy body, but she is great in all other areas... what does that make her?
What if a girl *does* have a playboy body, but is a total (b)(w)itch?
Anyone can answer please. I'm really curious. :-)
Etrenne: 7s? 10s? All those numbers! What happens to my score if I don't stick the landing? Or what if the East German judge is feeling particularly spiteful? If I mess up in the compulsories, can I make it up in the free style? Inquiring skirts want to know.
Cory: What makes a woman a 7 or a 10? It all depends but most guys would agree like women would agree with men... Brad Pitt = 10 right? Ricky Martin = 10 right? That's for the women by the way.... I don't look at guys. But its sort of the same thing. For me Drew Barrymore to me is a 7 or maybe an 8. To me though Jennifer Love Hewitt is an 8 or a 9 but if she was really Sara in real life and I really knew her I would marry this girl. Not talking about her but the character she plays. The way she looks into some ones eyes and that look of passion... Her smile she is the girl next door and that would be the girl for me. Women like Pam Anderson, Jenny McCarthy to me they would just be fun to play around with but not to have a real relationship with, because I know they would never stay faithful. It all depends on what you think is a 9 or a 10. It’s all of the above. Eyes, smile, hair, some women look great with glasses and some don’t. They don't have to have a playmate figure but I hate to sound shallow but I never would date a woman who was really over weight. I only weigh 160 and I don't want some one who is 50 pounds heavier than me.
Jill: To me, Brad Pitt isn't more than a 6. Ricky Martin is probably an 8 or 9, but definitely not a 10. Mel Gibson is a 10. That guy that plays Luka on ER is about a 9.5 (somebody already told me his name but names of celebs aren't something I can remember easily). But some other women would think I was nuts.
Don: I think using celebrities for 1-10 scales can be tricky. It seems most women on TV look great on-screen but not much cuter than the gen. population in real life. They're just 10-15# skinnier, which doesn't matter too much to me.
Give 90% of people a personal trainer, a professional make-up artist, public visibility, 2 weeks and they become hot.
Joel: [Rate girls by their looks on a scale of 1-10? ]
Um. Yea... my friends do anyway. I've noticed most of my friends haven't perfected the craft and therefore score a little differently than I (the one who truly knows) do.
Actually, every guy scores differently. So most women have a shot at the top numbers depending on the judge ;-)
[What makes a girl a 10?]
10's are going to be different for each guy. For me a 10 would be a combination of face and body that are well put together. It's hard to be a 10... and guys will argue over who qualifies. Some guys have never been to scoring school… So you can't trust them.
[Or a 7 that you talked about so much? ]
7's are the pretty cute girl, who gets a ton of attention because she's approachable and then starts to think she's a 9 because guys talk to her all the time. She knows she's not a 10 because Ronco hasn't come out with a version of the "Cinderella Mirror" that advanced yet. These are the girls that are out there en masse. They are more critical of guys than any other girl. They are waiting for rich, handsome, gentlemen to sweep them off their feet. She then becomes a 7B. (Explained in a bit). 1's to 6's are glad to have a guy talking to them at all and are generally nice friends. They marry all the out of shape guys with average jobs. They learn to be nice or they stay single. 10's are just glad to find a guy that can look them in the eye without puking due to nerves. 8's and 9's are often retired 10's. They are good 2nd marriage material.
7's that know they are 7's are marriage material.
[Smile, personality, humor ]
No, it's usually for rating people you don't know. Like at a bar etc. I think people do move up and down a notch or two depending on their warmth and personality.
[What if a girl doesn't have a playboy body, but she is great in all other areas... what does that make her? ]
A nice girl. Maybe marriage material, maybe not.
[What if a girl *does* have a playboy body, but is a total (b)(w)itch? ]
She's a 9B or 10B. B stands for bitch. Guys with any dignity won't talk with or look at a 10B much less pursue them. A guy might rent a 10B for an hour though.
I hope everyone knows this was tongue in cheek and I made it all up as I typed ;-) ...But there are some truths there if you dig - some secrets remain in the brotherhood.
Joel: This reminds me of something another guy mentioned to me recently. He said he recently visited Thailand and everyone was so nice. Then he returned to New York and barely looked at a woman and she gave him a hard time like he was a weirdo or something.
Kristy: What the heck is 'marriage material'? I've heard women use this too and it bugs me. It sounds like something you would buy at Home Depot. LOL
Joel: You can't really assign that value at initial inspection and objectification. You have to actually talk with a woman and date her a couple times to see if she's easy to be with. If she's got that combination of "attractive enough to get me moving" (4-9) depending on the guy's income) and "personality" then she's elevated to the rare status of marriage material.
I neglected to mention previously this important tidbit: 5, 6, or 7's will always beat out 7B, 8B, 9B and 10B's when a nice guy reaches for the telephone. If all a guy has left is B's (common), he will start with the 10B's. It's important to recognize that 7B's lose to everyone else in the event, yet many women choose to precariously position themselves there.
It should go without saying that 1B's to 6B's make up the largest part of The Peter PlayToys monthly mailing list.
Kristy: Sounds to me that 7s lose in every event.
Joel: No, no, no! 7B's lose to everyone. 7's can even beat 10's!
Josh: I think a lot of men rate women on a scale, or they talk openly with their friends about their ass(ets ). I have heard it said that women need affection before they can give sex, and men need sex before we give affection. I am a sensitive man, and have more women friends than men, but the female mind still mystifies me.
I do laundry, dishes, floors and windows, and like shopping. I remember birthdays, and love to touch and cuddle. But I am a pack rat and not always the neatest man in the world. It's sometimes frustrating, because I do like to be appreciated for my efforts. I think the answer to the age-old question... " What does a woman want? " I think the answer is... EVERYTHING!
Don: Actually talking to someone makes a difference and how they carries themselves. On a strict looks basis there isn't a whole hell of a lot to separate a 7 from a 10 to me, except when watching porno tapes. I have only seen 2 10+'s in my entire life - women who were hot enough to make me literally whistle on reflex.
If 7B's always lose why are there so many of them?
Joel: They get plenty of guys, just not the nice guys.
7B's exist in equal numbers as men that are jerks - and they all date. Occasionally a nice guy gets a 7B or vice-versa - and those become romance horror stories.
Melissa: I disagree with you about women not being interested in nice guys. I would love to meet just a regular, nice guy. Every time I think I have, I must do something to scare them away. Or worse, they tell me I am "Ms. Right Now" until someone better comes along or I am such a "good friend". So it seems there are a lot of guys and girls in the same boat.
Josh: I used to hear the same thing, of what a great friend I was, when I was hoping for more from women that I was interested in. One friend even called me a Diamond in the Rough! Talk about frustrating!
I have learned a lot about myself since those days, and have since had several long-term relationships. Maybe being a Taurus, (May 7th) as I am, is part of the problem? I have learned to watch my intense nature, and I balance it with humor.
Have you ever asked your male and female friends exactly what they think of you? I have been privileged to hear what effect I have had on people's lives. That, in itself, was very healing and reassuring.
Taffy: Some people in general have impossibly high standards so it's no shock when they find no one who can pass their test.
I like those more "primitive" cultures where single men & woman get paired up because gosh darn it they're single and want spouses.